Kick It Over Here Baby Pop
I’ve been meaning to weigh in on Casket before it drops. In short, the album is a failure. Not because it’s pop or wack or boring (though it is frequently all of these things) but because, for the first time, the Brothers Thorten just seem confused. At no point in their career (barring that unforgivable Koch-in remix project) did you ever once listen to a Clipse record and suspect that they were doing anything but exactly what they intended. Even when they diverged from the eyes down coke rap model – “Ma I Don’t Love Her” comes to mind – they were secure in those movements. They sold it. They understood the craft and knew what they wanted to do with it. And this was their appeal. Fuck skills and swagger and style, their primary selling point was a refined aesthetic.* Without that they are over-smart D-Boys trying to find a hit just like the dumb ones. High on their own supply or whatever whatever.
* And now they can’t even pick a cover. I prefer the original, uglier Kaws artwork. It seems appropriate.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:03 am
Also: Pharrell is done. They should have let Khalil produce the entire album.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:17 am
I’m pretty stunned by the utter lack of pathos or actual emotion on this album. It’s not the worst thing Ive heard this year but it’s probably the most disappointing.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:31 am
I agree with the commenters. I cannot find any emotion whatsoever in the album.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:46 am
pusha-t has been descending into horribleness
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:15 am
Khalli sucks just as bad. Get them on a Drumma Boy beat or some shit, maybe they’ll have a second wave of focus. Give Swizz a call maybe.
December 3rd, 2009 at 7:21 am
I just don’t understand how the fuck they got here. How can they have made Never Will it Stop and Doorman and not realize the rest of the album is just awful?
December 3rd, 2009 at 7:36 am
Aw what… really? I thought I’d just wait and buy it. Well the signs weren’t good. Bad. Malice is still good but Pusha sounds like he wants to be… er… not sure who. Someone?
December 3rd, 2009 at 11:00 am
Dudes seem to be really under the spell of Rick Ross and BP3 era Jay. The shoe doesn’t fit though..
December 3rd, 2009 at 11:55 am
I miss the re-up mixtapes
December 3rd, 2009 at 12:13 pm
you guys are all buggin, hell hath no fury went double wood, what would you perfer they do, be broke like all of you, and make inaccessible beats that only ‘true heads’ understand?
December 3rd, 2009 at 12:13 pm
Agreed. Shit sounds terribly phoned in. I find no reason whatsoever to pay attention, or perhaps more importantly, to actually buy the damn thing.
I happen to like a couple of Pharrell’s tracks, and feel less bullish on Khalil’s, but we’re more or less on the same page otherwise.
December 3rd, 2009 at 12:16 pm
Pharrell and the Neptunes are very far from being done. It’s juts that their musical sense has evolved well past that of coke raps. The track “I’m Good” shows both the Clipse and the Neptunes at their best. But then Chad & Pharrell decide to try their hand at making down south beats and fail miserably. The Khalil tracks add nothing sonically to the album at all. Malice and Pusha are still two formidable rappers, but it would seem that the coke rap era is tiring quickly, and perhaps they should move on to other topics. And while they’re at it, they need to grab some Premier beats or go to another producer who can cater to their style a bit better than the Neptunes.
December 3rd, 2009 at 12:27 pm
“you guys are all buggin, hell hath no fury went double wood, what would you perfer they do, be broke like all of you, and make inaccessible beats that only ‘true heads’ understand?”
Do you think that this album will prove to be a commercial success?
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:00 pm
“The track “I’m Good” shows both the Clipse and the Neptunes at their best.”
This is sex-with-your-sister wrong.
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:07 pm
Alienating your core audience by dumbing down your lyrics and diluting your signature sound is always a surefire road to success.
Butttttttttt…. Khalil > Swizz any day of the week.
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:11 pm
again..pharell is just the face…the chineese kid makes all the beats..they needed a darkie to appear with a skarteboard for thevarious magazine covers …
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:11 pm
The track “I’m Good” shows both the Clipse and the Neptunes at their best.
I’d argue this is the worst vocal performance of the album.
The beat is great (imho) but Clipse’ verses are lazy and sterile.
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:27 pm
“the chinese kid” hasn’t been credited on a neptunes beat in a long time…
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:34 pm
probably why they suck more than ever
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:35 pm
I agree that Khalil needed more tracks. Pretty much everything he was on was an album highlight. I wish the entire album sounded like “Footsteps.” However, I enjoyed the album. It’s certainly a departure, but I kind of appreciate the new moodiness. It’s not straight fuck the world coke slanging anymore, but a realization that they’ve been fucked as well. Before they seemed pissed off, but satisfied with life, whereas they now seem disgusted with life. To me it’s an interesting new dimension.
December 3rd, 2009 at 2:34 pm
I haven’t heard the whole thing, but based on what I have heard, it’s not THAT bad. Is it a perfect album? Obviously not. A disappointing follow-up to one of the best rap albums of the decade? Of course. But it has its moments. “Eyes On Me” in particular is a huge departure for both Clipse and the Neptunes, but it’s one of their best club/radio friendly tracks ever. And “Popeyes” is an above-average street single. I guess I’m partly just nostalgic for 2006, when Clipse were the great studio underdogs/mixtape kings, but there’s still way worse shit out there.
December 3rd, 2009 at 2:47 pm
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December 3rd, 2009 at 2:51 pm
Or not.
December 3rd, 2009 at 2:57 pm
i like the clipse…they just need to branch out more..and theyre beats need to catch up to the lyrrical delivery…u cant have hard lyrics with candy cane beats….
December 3rd, 2009 at 3:35 pm
See I don’t hear “moody” at all. I hear “bored”. Hell Hath No Fury… was moody. dark and brooding. Half of these beats sound like phoned in attempts at current club rap and the other half sound like by-the-numbers underground shit. Actually I do not really rate the Khalil tracks too tough my favorite *beats* are “Popeyes” and “I’m Good”. “Big Deal” goes… I don’t know man. This shit is forgettable as fuck
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:22 pm
Nobody can make 3 out of a straight 3 in sucession this decade. Not Cormega, not Z-Ro, not these guys.
I fear for the new Turf Talk.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:29 pm
Sumthin 2 Hate – Starshipz & Rocketz – Huntsville Intl beg to differ.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:37 pm
Don’t even know what anyone heard in the last album but at least people are belatedly shitting on them now. There’s just, in my view, a huge qualitative difference between Lord Willin or ‘What Happened To That Boy’ and everything afterwards, but all my attempts at adumbrating that difference have been miserable failures so I give up. I liked the early stuff because it was nasty and vicious and sneering, and to my ears they lost the sneering tone for pseudo-depth and boring posturing. Like could anyone point me to a 2006 equivalent of “ugh, another soul lost, had to make his shirt match my ox-blood-colored Porsche”?
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:47 pm
I don’t think I can remember another instance where I was THIS disappointed with an album. I couldn’t tell whether they thought that this record might make money, but I agree, they sound so out of place trying to make pop records, the formula just doesn’t work. It’s like they’re trying to be someone that they’re not and it just sounds incredibly uncomfortable. Also, Pusha sounds like he’s trying to imitate Kanye half the time, and the other half he just plain can’t rap. I always preferred Malice anyway, but Pusha just sounds awful here. Unfortunately, this will be the first Clipse album/mixtape that I don’t buy, which is a shame because I really do think that they are creative rappers when they stick to what works and I’d love to show them my support with my wallet. But I can’t justify doing that with this piece of shit album.
Also, agreed on Neptunes vs. Khalil. I thought at first that the problem might be that they didn’t let Pharrell and Chad produce the whole thing, but the ‘Tunes beats also suck! Major, major, major let down for me on all fronts.
December 3rd, 2009 at 4:55 pm
tray otm. hell hath was uninteresting save the intro & “mr. me too”. haven’t heard this one but they fell off after they took this arrogant kingpin attitude instead of rapping with the hunger & desperation of we got it 4 cheap vol. 2
btw i would like to point out that i called this basically exactly a year ago http://somanyshrimp.com/2008/12/02/this-is-bullshit/ (altho i am smh at somehow including gorilla zoe in there)
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:16 pm
I had to scroll through about 50 different meanings of OTM to figure you meant on the mark/money. Actually, though, I didn’t think Mr. Me Too was interesting except for the little ominous synth-things that come in in the last 15 seconds (Jeezy’s take on it on I Am The Street Dream was a lot more fun), whereas I am fairly cool with Momma I’m Sorry, but admittedly the most interesting thing on that is the accordion. I do like bits of the rapping though – definitely marred by the arrogant kingpin attitude (good call), but it has its moments, like Pusha’s “Sorry, Heavenly Father, once again I hate to bother,” though typically the line doesn’t come out of any actual sense of guilt; rather it’s just an ostentatious way of bragging about the enormity of his crimes. But there is something interesting about the rushed way he delivers the line – a mixture of arrogance and genuine nervousness about taking up God’s time.
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:19 pm
Edan – Echo Party>>new rap
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:28 pm
@noz
“Do you think that this album will prove to be a commercial success?”
It will sell more than than Hell Hath without question.
We gotta remember Raekwon only moved 80k units.
This album has at least a chance to make 150k opening sales which would be pretty good.
I feel this album is super polished, well produced, a departure, but honest.
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:37 pm
“Like could anyone point me to a 2006 equivalent of “ugh, another soul lost, had to make his shirt match my ox-blood-colored Porsche”?”
I don’t know about 2006, but there’s a line on CNN’s “My Hood” that sounds like old Clipse:
“Writing’s on the wall, got the whole city buyin vowels
Turn them O’s over for my fortune, Vanna White style”
December 3rd, 2009 at 5:41 pm
um in the year 2009 where mariah carey had a bona fide hit in “obsessed” and flopped ‘memoirs’ @ #3 behind paramore i think you’re pretty deluded to think that clipse is going to move 150k
December 3rd, 2009 at 6:15 pm
LOL @ this album selling 150,000.
-e
December 3rd, 2009 at 6:18 pm
Speaking of new stuff, is the new Juvenile album worth checking out?
December 3rd, 2009 at 7:13 pm
Dissapointed yes, complete loss; no. This album does seem to be missing a lot of substance but at least there’s a song with Cam thats pretty dope.
Samson.
December 3rd, 2009 at 10:42 pm
The Door Man joint rocks. I wasnt feelin Im Good but radio in DC was feelin that tune. The hard joints knock the rest is passable. I wouldnt count these dudes out. Cant make back to back Hell Hath I guess!
December 3rd, 2009 at 11:35 pm
wow… i dig the kaws cover and i thought it was more of the same but damn… ppl are really trashin this– im still gonna say its gettin constant play on my ipod… and yeah door man is crazy
December 4th, 2009 at 10:10 am
the best beats are “popeyes” & “doorman”. 2 pharrell joints.
December 4th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
OK I HAD A LISTEN AND I GOTTA SAY:
CBO- TILL MY CASKET DROPS>>>> THIS BULLSHIT
December 4th, 2009 at 2:20 pm
Yep – a spot on appraisal again. Gonna go and put on ‘Young Boy’ to remember the good times.
December 5th, 2009 at 1:08 am
This is definitely Clipse’s worst album but I think it’s still better than most major label shit going on at the moment. I think their main downfall is bland production. The beats are solid but never as interesting as HHTN.
December 5th, 2009 at 1:09 am
i mean HHNF
December 5th, 2009 at 1:26 am
FOH Noz
Speak of Freedom>>>>
plus Doorman(!!) There was a Murder, Popeyes, Big Deal, Footsteps and Life change are all dope
December 5th, 2009 at 1:30 am
Pusha T is Rick Ross’ ghostwriter….think about it….makes a lot of sense really, and explains the sonic similarities and collabo(?)
December 5th, 2009 at 5:29 am
If Rick Ross has a ghostwriter he should fire the motherfucker, because Ross uses the same goddamn rhyme structure in every song.
duh duhduh duhduhduh RHYME
duh duhduh duhduhduh RHYME
duh duhduh duhduhduh duhduh
duh duhduh duhduhduh RHYME
Fuck that shit.
December 5th, 2009 at 12:04 pm
in all honesty in think the album is pretty great, the beats are crazy, and there is a good bit of emotion, really my only problem is that malice is all of a sudden a born again jesus freak and its just weird and boring, pusha goes hard on the introspective songs, where as malice just says, look to god, its dumb
December 5th, 2009 at 1:36 pm
its so amazing to me ((c) Lil B) that people seem to still listen to Rick Ross
December 6th, 2009 at 4:18 pm
Malice always had some sense of providence to him “gymstar razor the fruits of my labor and I walk with a glow it’s like the lord showin favor”. So now Malice says “I miss my homie but she’s missing a dad/ it weighs on my conscience and I hate conscious raps.” Sounds honest to me- I mean his answer doesn’t work, but his questions are real, and any hipster And DJ Khalil all that? Really? That chorus just about sabotages Footsteps.
December 8th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
@B.S. above re: Juvenile album: I took a listen, & I’d have to say no. He sounded lazy, the guests were lame, & I don’t think I heard even one Mannie Fresh beat on that bitch (despite the YouTube promo acting like Mannie was doing at least half).
As for Clipse: Skip the 1st track & play through until “there’s been a murder”. Skip it & play “door man”. It would’ve made a good EP. As an album it’s Fail.
December 19th, 2009 at 12:34 am
Are we listening to the same album? Champion, Footsteps and Life Change are some of the best records I’ve ever heard from them.
December 19th, 2009 at 7:12 pm
OVEROK these same dudes think Wacka Flocka can rap… sooo you can’t expect them to grow along with the Clipse.
December 24th, 2009 at 10:54 am
yeh true